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| BallisticPro (Balance, gameplay, fixes) http://www.runestorm.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=75703 |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 5:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | BallisticPro (Balance, gameplay, fixes) |
This is a work in progress attempt to take Ballistic away from its current hybrid state of having features both related to gameplay and realism and pull it in the direction of gameplay for online use. The philosophy is to stick as closely as possible to the original functionality and play of the weapons except when to do so would break either logic (M353, f.ex) or balance (AM67, f.ex). Prepare for an essay... ==================== Changelog (v0.1): ==================== Non-balance changes MutBallisticPro This does two things at the moment. First is a cheap workaround for Assault where weaponlockers don't quite give as much ammo as you'd like by spawning an ammo pack with a 1 second respawn time at the middle of the locker (I know, I'm totally lame). Second increases the walking speed to be 75% of the running speed instead of 50%, and switches the animations around to be running. I know what you're thinking. Why mess with that? It's simple. While other games have walking speeds at half of running speeds, other games have cover and maps that were built specifically for that style of play. BW not only has quite a dependable sprint, but it inherits dodging, jumping, double-jumping and the general feel of UT2004 from its host game. Factoring in the kind of movement that is possible in UT2004, which is mostly limited when you go into iron sighting mode, 50% speed is simply too slow for UT's maps, and when other players aren't simply running - they're side dodge jumping instead, which is a hell of a lot faster. Iron sights Every weapon in the list below has a modified sighting time. Only two of them are higher than the default and most of them are significantly lower. Pistols are extremely fast at 0.15 seconds. Most standard weapons are at 0.35. Shotguns are 0.4 (requiring you to set up by listening to footsteps if you really want that one shot kill) and machineguns, due to the way I've tinkered with them with vehicles in mind, are at 1.0 for the 353 and 1.2 for the 925. The end result of this is that instead of BW being about spamming hipfire first and using sights second (because sights are like playing in treacle), it's about sights, sound and prediction first, and hipfire spam is reserved for close range unexpected battles as it should be. At least, I hope it is. Additionally, all light weapons (that means every one-handed weapon, even dualled) can be ironsighted while running. Attempting fancy movement such as dodging or jumping will drop the scope again, so this is effectively just a 33% speed boost over normal speed. The ability to set up more quickly than before should work to give players a better chance against abuse of zero skill weapons which either track unfairly, have a massive explosive radius or are just plain spam, like the G5, the NRP57 avec cook abuse (guilty!) or the HvC "Point At Someone And They Die" Lightning Gun. Damage Normalisation Damage for BallisticPro weapons is normalised for almost every weapon (all except the M925 and the R78) to modifiers of 1.5x headshot, 1x body, 1x limb. This is because firstly, Ballistic's locational damage detection is quite lame. Testing with Show Damage, almost all hits to the body on a target register as hits to the limbs, resulting in access to damage ranges as irritating as (5-15) or (35-50). The problem is compounded online, as a client-side strike to the body is shifted on the server to be a strike to the arm or leg. With limbs and body counting as one, damage is more reliable. Secondly, the damage ranges were completely out of whack. The most egregious offenders are the SRS-900 (from what I remember, it has limb damage around 15-25, body damage 25-35 and head damage 90-120 - just what?) and the XK2 (which jumps from doing 15 damage to scoring 40-80 in its easily accessible headshot region). Normalising damage ensures that fights don't come down to whoever lucked the most headshots, as that is the only reliable place to hit to do any damage. Balance changes The following weapons are modified for balance and the abbreviated changes from my notepad are added alongside. If a weapon is not here, it does not have a BallisticPro equivalent. SRS-900: Lowered this weapon's capacity to 10. Only scopes while crouching. The headshot damage for this weapon was so high compared to the body damage that this weapon has been nerfed as a result of my damage normalisation, but quite frankly it breaks the game in vanilla. R9 rifle: Increased chaos. Lowered damage from 70 to 40. Reason for this is that the R9 was extremely solid from the hip with very high damage for an accurate, quickfiring semi-automatic rifle. XK2, XRS10, Fifty-9: These weapons have been modified extensively. They deal high damage at close range, losing damage rapidly over range until hitting a minimum damage value (think CoD4.) Apart from that they do approximately equal DPS, as the individual features of each weapon are enough to differentiate them. AM-67: Lowered damage to 40 per shot (on par with R9 rifle). Lowered capacity to 5 rounds. Increased flash cooldown to 15 seconds. AM-67 flash spam coupled with ridiculously high capacity and ridiculously high damage made it a pain in the arse. M353: Overhauled (and may not be too popular for that.) I felt the original M353 made no sense - a machinegun that did less damage than a submachinegun didn't work for me. Dramatically increased damage (30-40). Decreased fire rate slightly. Dramatically increased sway from all stances. Increased sighting time (this and the M925 are the only weapons that have a high sighting time). Dramatically increased recoil. Reduced capacity to 70. It may turn out that that is an overnerf to the 353, but it can be deployed and there are ways to work around all the nerfs, so it still may be too strong like that. M925: Increased rate of fire, increased damage. Dramatically increased recoil and sway from all stances. The weapon's recoil still obscures your aim when it's sighted. Both of these weapons are intended primarily as anti-vehicle deployables which can conveniently mash infantry. Please also note that they contain a fix for Invasion. Any attack which strikes the turret will damage the turret's owner. This will be fixed in v0.2 (i.e. when I'm sure there's enough interest in this kind of project) to only apply when the attacker is a Monster... unless people like not having the machinegun's turret block enemy fire as an impenetrable shield. S-AR 12: No change. M50: Increased rate of fire and decreased damage to give same damage per second values but better approximation of the M4 Carbine the weapon is based on. This also makes the weapon slightly less ammo efficient compared to the S-AR 12, but the M50 has better recoil, a grenade and its camera. M763: No change. Redwood "DeerMaster" Rifle: Kept damage high to compensate for the abysmal reload time of this weapon. MRS-138: No change. A73 Skrith Rifle: Damage increased. The A73 sees hardly any use as a projectile weapon, especially with the ViPeR around to be all overpowered >_> R78 Rifle: Increased damage (140/85/75). Only scopes when crouched. D49: Decreased fire rate and damage. The damn thing was a better sniper rifle than the R78. Wilson 41: Damage reduced to 35. GRS9, RS8, M806: Damage normalised. Weapons to do: Grenades - remove easy cooking indicator. G5, M75, RX22A, etc: Kill superweapons in non-vehicle gametypes M290, ViPeR: think of some kind of way to fix these monstrosities. Installation You'll need to back up your Ballisticv21.ini and replace each instance of a Ballistic weapon with its equivalent in this mod. I had to subclass every weapon to make these changes. The available weapons are listed above in the changelog - if a weapon isn't there, it doesn't have a variant in the mod. All classnames are of the form "BallisticPro.<WeaponName>QS". For example, "BallisticV21.R78Rifle" becomes "BallisticPro.R78RifleQS". All the subclassed weapons have "QS" appended to their inventory names, so if you use the GUI to make your loadouts, you should be OK too. If you test this, be sure to put the BallisticPro mutator on as well. There'll be some problems in this somewhere. If you decide to test this, let me know. Given general opinion of me here, I don't check this forum frequently. I'm usually checking every 7-15 days. My Xfire is b2kuklone and the email I don't mind being spammed with is [email protected]. If there's any interest in me doing this and other modders are willing I'm more than prepared to balance your weapons for you, as long as you give me a set of guidelines for how you want your weapon to be (i.e. x-rifle intended to be an y-firing z-damage weapon intended for z purpose) and only oppose my changes from a balance standpoint. In turn, I will not remove any functionality you lay out. http://highvoltage.inx-gaming.co.uk/BallisticPro.rar (This is being uploaded as I was asked to upload my quick-sighting package in a PM. Usually I just play offline with this. I'll be putting this on my UK-based server and giving the IP out in a few days.) |
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| Author: | Sgt. Kelly [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:18 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Ooh, another balance pack.  I'm downloading now and will test it out later. I'm interested in seeing how this compares with Kaboodles's previously released bonus packs and the community packs. Feel free to use the community content in your balance set, though remember to give proper credit where it is due. |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Tue Feb 02, 2010 8:23 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
I will be sure to remember to give the credit as appropriate. I'll do the Beta 8 weapons tomorrow, since it will all be compatible. The advantage of being ill is that I have an excuse to take a break from the more artistic projects and get down to some good old tinkering. |
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| Author: | SHAD0Wdump [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 9:12 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Azarael wrote: or the HvC "Point At Someone And They Die" Lightning Gun. Doncha mean 'HVC "Point At Someone and Shoot the Walls, Ceiling, and Floor" Lightning Gun? |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Wed Feb 03, 2010 10:28 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Heh, there are so many things to say about the HvC that I just went for the easiest one.  Current issues (thanks, Sergeant Kelly): * Scopes work while walking. I overrode CheckScope when I didn't need to. Fixed. * Fifty9 rocked. Reduced damage slightly. * M50 has too little recoil for the amount of ass it kicks. Increased recoil. * AM-67 was overnerfed. Reduced its time to kill by one third. |
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| Author: | Captain Xavious [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Cool! Should be pretty nifty.
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| Author: | Azarael [ Thu Feb 04, 2010 1:55 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
http://highvoltage.inx-gaming.co.uk/Bal ... rov015.rar ====================== Changelog, v0.15 ====================== E-23 ViPeR Rifle added. Damage reduced, scope and all related functionality, including the rather useless and buggy Sniper Pulse firemode, removed. Chaos significantly increased. Weapon now has normal ironsights. G5 added. Some of you may remember my opinion of this weapon as one of the big three (G5, RX22A, HVC) that ruined standard Ballistic. The weapon has been reworked into a long-range anti-vehicle and anti-emplacement mortar, which some people would have argued that it should have been in the first place. G5 no longer fires from the hip at all. There'll be a warning indicator for this in the future if people don't like the current implementation. Naturally, the laser firemode has also been removed. This means the G5 can only fire in its mortar configuration from the sights. It will still lock on to any target. The net effect of these changes mean that the G5 can't be used to splatter infantry using nothing but the laser and close-range rockets, even in the scope. Reworked the FP7, T10 and NRP57. The fuse indicator was removed, as it enabled users to accurately bomb opponents with the NRP in particular. Increased M353 and M925 wall penetration by a factor of three. ================== Changelog ends. ================== I've decided I won't be touching the RX22A and HvC, as there's nothing I can do with them to make them fair. I also won't be touching the HAMR, either of the staves, or the Peacemaker. I'd recommend using the staves as a superweapon replacement, the Peacemaker as a Target Painter replacement and the HAMR to replace the Grenade Launcher. If I modifiy the BX5 and FP9 it will be to cause them to fail to spawn in infantry gametypes. Mines impede flow horribly, but in the end you cannot trust most server admins, with some notable exceptions like Dorian, to keep the crap out by themselves. The only pending weapons from the base set are the M75-TIC and the M290. ================= Edit ================= I'm no longer hosting a server for UT2004 either. I'm tired of almost forcing people to play on them - people have a tendency to claim they want something but then resort to keeping what they've got with the rationalisation that it's too much effort to move. This is aimed at the UT2004 Assault community. Given the chances of a balance pack being used by anyone other than myself I will no longer be continuing this project. Enjoy your G5s. - Azarael |
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| Author: | hide_in_light [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 2:13 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Links don't work |
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| Author: | Sgt. Kelly [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:39 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Quitting again, eh? That was fast. |
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| Author: | Blade sword [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 6:43 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
Be patient 
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| Author: | Sgt. Kelly [ Sun Feb 07, 2010 7:07 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
For achiving's sake, I would recommend putting the link up on ModDB, Blade Sword. We should have three balance packs now: - Kaboodles's complete one. - OC Adam's large one. - Azarael's small one. By the way, want me to help you with the images? You don't seem to have any up for the packs. I can help fix up the grammar too, if you want. |
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| Author: | Blade sword [ Mon Feb 08, 2010 6:05 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
I posted the Kab one, but I don't know where is the OCAdam one, at least the latest, I remember it was Ballistic realistic; I will post the Azarael one then, I prefered to wait that he finished his pack before posting it EDIT: His link doesn't work  If someone have files please send me a PM with them or simply a PM I will see if there is a mean to post them. Also any news about OCAdam ? I don't see him since a while |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Fri Feb 04, 2011 12:35 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (v0.1 WIP) |
http://upload-it.ch/upload/BallisticProV24.zip Changes: Added the Flamer, G5 and Nova Staff. - G5 only fires in Mortar mode. - Nova Staff is nerfed, given quick sights and designed for use as an above-average weapon replacement. Its God-level firemodes and health regeneration remain intact as it's a projectile weapon and has a hard enough time as it is. From skimming the ABA forums, I see a lot of complaint about the staves, so why not try using this one instead? - Weapons from this pack no longer jolt your aim when you're shot while using them. - Weapons from this pack no longer cock when picked up - it's a waste of valuable time and was annoying quite a lot of people. They will, however, cock if reloaded when empty. - You can now run flat out while using the ironsights, but dodging and sprinting will take them down. - Buffed the R78 Sniper and Redwood 6000 DeerMaster heavily and reduced the recoil of the R78 to prevent the online recoil bug, where the shot is paradoxically fired on the server in the middle of its own recoil. - Minor balance changes to all SMG weapons, certain pistols, the E-23 ViPeR and the S-AR 12. And from the previous logs: - All weapons have quick sights. - Ammo packs are spawned on weapon lockers. - Grenades in Loadout (and ones replacing weapons, not ammo, in Swap) no longer have a cooking timer. - Certain balance changes. The pack is in use on the LDG BW server and the archive contains the server's BallisticV21.ini file, which is my suggested swapping for the weapons. All weapon classnames are their default names with QS on the end, for example BWBPFour.RSNovaPickup -> BallisticProV24.RSNovaPickupQS Edit: I just read the previous communique. If you want this uploaded to ModDB be my guest - I didn't upload it myself because it's RS's page. |
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| Author: | lepmuR [ Fri Feb 04, 2011 2:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Nice work ! I hope you continue this package, its imo the best rebalancing package out there. Small sized and nicely done. Good job. Im looking forward to see some updates ! |
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| Author: | Blade sword [ Fri Feb 04, 2011 2:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
I think it should have its own thread BTW I posted your mod at moddb |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Fri Feb 04, 2011 4:38 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Thanks @ both. |
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| Author: | DeathSparx [ Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:59 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Question: Do we have to d/l every link or is everything included with every update? |
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| Author: | Blade sword [ Mon Feb 07, 2011 7:29 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Everything is included in the updates |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:17 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
BallisticProV26, BWInteractions2, BallisticAndUTComp http://upload-it.ch/upload/BWProV26.zip BWInteractions2 (basic code by Izumo_CZ) - Adds a tab to the Esc menu named "Ballistic Binds". Will allow you to bind most keys using Interactions, avoiding the need to change binds using exec when switching between BW and standard. Recommended for public servers and includes all important binds. BallisticandUTComp (modified by Izumo_CZ) - Modifies UTComp to work properly with the Ballistic weapon switch interface. The team overlay also disappears when the interface is brought up. No real excuse not to use this now. BallisticProV26 - Locked BWPro automatic weapon fire to its crosshairs using ViewRecoilFactor, in order to have somewhat more controllable hip fire. - All BWPro weapons start with more ammo when picked up. This also affects weaponlockers, eliminating the need for my cheap hack mutator of spawning an ammo pack on the locker. - Most weapons reload and cock 25% faster. - Added M290, M75-TIC Railgun and Dark Star support. - Stripped the Nova Staff and Dark Star of the more unique powers, mainly because they're bugged online. They retain their soul mechanic, rampage firemodes and rampage boosts, but no longer have damage resistance against their own shots, health regeneration, melee auto-lockon (Dark Star), health regeneration (Nova Staff) or any form of ammo regeneration by dealing or taking damage. - Dark and Nova require only 6 souls instead of 10 to power-up to compensate for being nerfed down from superweapons. - Nova lightning and Dark plasma cost more ammo to fire. - Boosted G5 direct mortar damage against vehicles. - RX-22A is treated as a superweapon, with WeaponStay permanently off. - Lowered M75-TIC damage. - Lowered M925 recoil and damage. - Boosted A-73 Skrith Rifle projectile speed. - Reduced SMG and AR damage slightly. - Lowered Pineapple grenade damage. Pineapples are limit 4 and give 2 grenades per pickup. - Added some recoil to the SRS. - Fixed GRS9 log spam, I hope. |
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| Author: | Blade sword [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:19 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
You can add your files in the moddb profile
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| Author: | Azarael [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
ModDB updated with a full summary of changes from V15 to V26. |
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| Author: | Yokelassence3 [ Fri Feb 11, 2011 5:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
I wish that Runestorm could include some of these changes in BW 2.5 officially (if it comes out) Shorter reload times, no cocking on weapon pickup, no aim jolting when shot, and running while scoped would really save me a lot of frustration (don't know how many times I've been killed because I have to cock every gun I pick up) BTW: One thing I would have liked to see regarding the Staves is simplified fire modes I don't like how god mode for both staves staples two extra firemodes, giving you 5. That's way too many, especially when 2 is pretty much all you use which forces you to tap the fire mode key 3 times in order to switch between the 2 you want. Entering God mode should give you fire modes that replace the original 3, not append them |
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| Author: | lepmuR [ Sat Feb 12, 2011 5:19 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Well, i just love you <3!!!!! Edit: I hope you will bring your mut also on Fische11s and Sgt.Kellys packs. It really need an overhaul, both weaponpacks are totaly overpowered and when you play competitve in a ladder this packs fall out of the game, due to theire instant kill lvls. |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Sat Feb 12, 2011 6:35 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
I will look into the staves some more. I personally play with all the firemodes, as slow charge has splash, fast charge has range damage and the lightning and plasma create Deathballs when used to block shots from the oppositely aligned staff. Regarding weapon packs: Sgt. Kelly has given me his permission to balance his team's weapons provided all changes are run past him first. However, we discussed yesterday that it would be best to wait until the full release of v9, as the weapon code, assets and packages of the pack are constantly in flux and some of the code won't yet work online, which is my main testing arena. For now I will concentrate on fixing any errors and imbalances in BWPro that come up on my server and, if necessary, add support for BW v2.5 weapons. |
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| Author: | DeathSparx [ Sun Feb 13, 2011 12:43 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
This pack sounds pretty good (but I unfortunately won't have a chance to try it out anytime soon due to school), but I was wondering by how much did you lower the M75-TIC Rail gun. Don't forget it is a super sniper that can shoot through walls, so it should be an instant kill for people (not to forget a limited ability to see through walls with the thermal scope). I'm merely curious... 
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| Author: | TurdDrive [ Sun Feb 13, 2011 2:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
IT is a Rail gun. So it has the ability to shoot a couple of times the speed of sound. So it should be able to shoot through walls. |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Sun Feb 13, 2011 10:02 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Regarding the M75: Damage is 200 to head, 150 to body and 120 to limb when fully charged. Note that in BWPro, all bullet weapons have increased wall penetration and as such the M75's ability to penetrate walls efficiently is no longer unique to it. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suspension ... ideo_games Wikipedia wrote: Video games are also said to require suspension of disbelief. Often realism is compromised even in games that set out to be realistic, either intentionally to not overly complicate game mechanics or due to technical limitations. BWPro will never put "realism" over balance or gameplay - indeed, the mod was designed to ditch the overly realistic factors that were murdering the gameplay. There are already plenty of unrealistic factors in UT, for example, being shot in the arm and retaining perfect aim, being shot in the leg and retaining perfect movement, head shots being valued far more than body and limb shots despite the potential for vital organ damage, especially to the heart and lungs, and ripping off limbs. Outside of that, the ability to jump while holding a railgun or another heavy weapon is another obvious example. If the M75 no longer kills in one hit at lower charge levels, I personally won't be losing much sleep over it. |
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| Author: | Captain Xavious [ Sun Feb 13, 2011 9:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Sounds pretty good to me. Its purposed to be primarily an anti-tank weapon in your balance pack anyways, isn't it? If you want anti-personal, the R98 is pretty superior. Even in regular BW, it seems to me that the R98 is better than the M75 anyways for rapid people splattering. |
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| Author: | Azarael [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 10:53 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
Yeah, the M75 replaces the AVRiL in my config. In vanilla BW, the M75 grossly outperforms the R78, which is a sound last in the hierachy of snipers due to the recoil bug and terribly low damage. However, in the current version of BWPro it's the other way around - I forgot to zero the M75's recoil to eliminate the recoil bug, so the M75 is completely unreliable compared to the solid R78. Update coming to fix that and adjust a few other things in a while. |
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| Author: | Captain Xavious [ Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:33 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: BallisticPro (Quick sights, balance changes, etc) |
I dunno, at least in invasion, the R78 seems to have more power than an uncharged M75. Seems more useful with faster firing to me at least. |
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