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[MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
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Author:  Bulska [ Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:30 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
I'm making a new CTF map which is a large structure high up a desert. Nobody knows who built it in the first place, but it is known all over the universe that it is now a Liandri Arena.
That was the description of the map, I've started working at it about three days ago... and I hadn't got alot of time to make it big. But I got some screenshots from the work so far.

I got a problem, I use jumppads to get from HIGH ground to LOW ground to move a far distance. But, it hurts around 20 health. How can I make it do no damage if you fall there? Is there any special volume?

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Author:  Captain Xavious [ Wed Apr 25, 2007 9:46 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Answer to your question: Yes, there is a volume you could add near the landing point ot prevent the damage. Add a physics volume and adjust I think TerminalVelocity. Can't rememeber if higher makes it less damage or if lower does it, but I'm sure you could figure it out. :)

That looks like an incredible map! Not too crazy about regular CTF but I can't wait to try it. :)

Actually, now that I think about it, you can probably get away with putting that physics volume somewhere in the flight path to at least temporarily slow the character down, if you don't want people to be slowed down by landing on the area regardless of where they jump from.
Author:  Mr.UglyPants [ Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:47 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Looks awesome.
Author:  Bulska [ Wed Apr 25, 2007 4:29 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
I got another question for gameplay in the map.

Should I make it like this:
From the FlagBase to the Middle, Jumppads help you travel faster, Flag carrier can easily get out of enemy's base.
Or should I make it like this:
From the Middle to the Flagbase, Jumppads help you travel faster, A quick assault to capture the flag is possible.

So... when you have the flag, go fast home?
Or... when you go attack, go fast to the flag?
Author:  Bulska [ Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:12 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Why doesn't anybody ever check the Map topics :/
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Thu Apr 26, 2007 2:58 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Although my judgement might not be the best available (not much of a CTF player), I'd say it'd be better for quick assaults.
Author:  Bulska [ Thu Apr 26, 2007 3:53 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
If you have the flag, everybody will be on your tail. So a quick return to your base would be nice. And it would also be logical:

Hard to get in the base, easy to get out.
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Thu Apr 26, 2007 5:22 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Hmm... I think easy to get in the base, hard to get out equally makes sense though (at least to me). In that case I haven' t a clue what would be better.
Author:  Bulska [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 2:58 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
lol, think of a castle.

Hard to get into the castle, because of closed gates and high walls.
But easy to get out of it, just open the gates from the inside.

And I hate being unable to get out of the base with 4 people on my tail.
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 3:41 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Heh heh... well, I think in that case you're best bet would be to make the jump pads get you out of the bases. ;)
Author:  Bulska [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 5:18 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
made that already :D I tried it and it goes alot faster to get out than to get in.
I also made a door which only opens from one side... How do I get bots to understand such a door?
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 6:43 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
I wish I could help you, but I haven't gotten into bot pathing yet...
Author:  Bulska [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 3:37 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
I have completed all BSP and Lighting, maybe I missed the smallest detail, but I think that's ready so far.
The thing that awaits me now is Pickups, Start Points and Both Pathing. Those take a long time aswell.
So I'm far from finished, I'm also planning to make a Bombing Run version of the map playing in the night. That wouldn't take too long, just adjusting the lighting and game objectives. Easy! Hmm maybe I can make a DM version too..

Here's map with BSP+Lighting+2Flags+Jumppads+Whatever.
http://files.filefront.com/CTF_B_Ancien ... einfo.html

Please give me hints and bug report of the map. I want this map to be one of my best.
Also, I can't think of a really great name... So far I got CTF-B-AncientConcrete... If anyone could think of a better name I would add him in the readme ^^
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Fri Apr 27, 2007 4:34 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Cool! Downloading in a few minutes. :)
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Sat Apr 28, 2007 9:39 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
WOW! This is an amazing map! !amazed

I did notice a few bugs though.

The jump pads that are located right next to the armor pickups right before the flags need a bit of work. I seem to always be hitting the edge of where you land and end up falling to my death. :P
I think this mainly happens when I hold forward when I fly through the air. It also seems to happen on one side more often than the other.

I can see the the skybox seams on the floor when falling to my death. This is really minor, but a suggestion might be to put some cloud cover in the sky box that kid of obscures the ground, but again, this is really minor.

Another thing is with the elevators. When I walk on them they don't activate, I have to jump on them in order to get them to go up. Its not a bad bug, and for all I know you made it like that intentionally. Either way, i just figured I should point it out.

Also, in the middle of the arena where the two bases meet, there are sniper bunkers that require an elevator to go into. I didn't do a lot of testing with them, but it seems awfully hard to get out of them without falling to death.

I also have a couple suggestions.

One main thing I noticed is that there doesn't really seem to be many ways to safely travel from the second layer of the map to the bottom layer.

I thought of a couple things that could possibly fix that. One would be to make it so you don't get hurt as much from falling for the entire level (Adjusting the Terminal Velocity) and another possibility is maybe make physics volumes that have a negative or lower gravity, then adding some emitters that show debris or dust or something blowing up to make it look like an updraft. These could really add some interesting twists to the level and quite possibly give people another route to go higher, or a safe rout to go lower, or even a way to make really long jumps over wide chasms.

Another thing is those jump pads that are in the bases, the ones that are just there to send you through the room faster. You need to make them go further, because right now they seem to do very little.

Also, I think you need to make the kill zone a bit higher, that way you don't see where the static meshes start right before you die.

Oh yeah, and this map is awesome with the lightning gun! :P

Can't wait for a final version of this, it's definitely being added to our LAN Game map list! 8)
Author:  Bulska [ Sat Apr 28, 2007 11:38 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
All things you noticed and told me (except for the extra routes) I have noticed aswell. All jumppads are buggy, And I know how to fix them. The KillZone higher up has been noticed by my brother.

And the sniper towers, if you walk towards one of the elevator exits, you trigger it. So just wait a sec and the elevator shows up. I guess that many people wouldn't see this, and that I'd need to make more ways down.

Also, did you notice what all those symboles mean? There are three different sizes of the symbole.
The smallest, seen in the hallways and on some walls.
The larger ones, seen mostly outside.
And 2 huuuge ones. Find them :D
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Sat Apr 28, 2007 12:42 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Yeah, I noticed those symbols. Thay look pretty sweet. 8)

Reminds me of the Quake 2 symbol, actually. :)

Hmm... I have a pretty good idea where those huge ones are... ;)

Yep, just where I thought they were. Nice implementation, Bulska. 8)
Author:  Bulska [ Wed May 02, 2007 3:49 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
New Version coming up fast, I've fixed everything you said in your bug report post. Lets see if there are any other bugs left or new bugs around :D
Author:  Bulska [ Wed May 02, 2007 4:30 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Ok all finished and ready for testing
No, not completely finished, I mean that I followed your suggestions and Ive fixed the bugs you've found.
^^

Anyways, here's a link:
http://files.filefront.com/CTF_B_Ancien ... einfo.html
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Wed May 02, 2007 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Cool! Downloading now. :)
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Thu May 03, 2007 7:40 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Alright, finally got a chance to test it a little bit and I'd say that's pretty damn awesome!
Author:  ShadowBlade [ Fri May 04, 2007 3:53 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
thats pretty impressive 8)
Author:  Bulska [ Fri May 04, 2007 5:50 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Any bugs? ^^
Author:  Captain Xavious [ Fri May 04, 2007 6:16 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
I didn't see any, but I didn't get enough time to thoroughly test it for bugs yet.
Author:  Meatboy [ Mon May 07, 2007 10:55 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
DOwn loading to test now. I tried the map early on and had some questions about the map layout but if you are this far along I wont make suggestions unless you want em. I do play CTF as the main game on ut so I have a good feel for what makes a good flow. I'll get the map and serch for bugs.
Author:  Bulska [ Mon May 07, 2007 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
All advices are welcome
Author:  Meatboy [ Mon May 07, 2007 12:47 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
K here is the first run through.

1. Bugs found

A. BLue base main elevator that leads to the flag the floor texture is detached. It rise along with the elevator but below it. You can get on and use the elevator but run the chance of falling through.

B. team spawn points need fixing. I found myself spawning in the blue base, left side near the steam jet near the edge. Blue bots wouls also spawn in the same place on the red side from time to time.


2. Minor gameflow changes.

A. Extend the platform and close the extension in on the sniper platforms elevator shaft. The Elevator is a nifty thing and adds a great feel to the map, but from the fist and second room give the players a chance to jump down {With falling damage} to speed game play along. Right know you either wait for the elevator or die trying to jump down.

B. Add a jump pad on the lower netural bridge that would allow a plyer to gain access to the uppper level through the hole in the bridge. This would allow a flag runner a way to escape pursuit, and for ambushers a chace to get to the flag runner going over thier heads.

C.Upper level Center of Level over main path to flag base. Add an opening to allow a player to jump down, {with damage of course} and head up the flag bridge. The advantages of this would be to allow the flag grabber one more route in and the defenders another place to defend rather then just lurking near the elevators.

D. One way Drop doors on upper levels. They need some form of lighting cue so folks will know what they are. I found them by running close enough to trigger them. Other wise I would have not noticed them at all.

E. add some audibles for the steam lifter vents, so folks will know they are there. Also this whole begs for some wind audibles over the bridges and the exposed parts of the upper level and top of the sniper towers.

Time for work. I'll run the map again tonight and look for more bugs and add suggestions for major changes weapon and health placement.
Author:  Bulska [ Tue May 08, 2007 7:42 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
yeh can you speak easier english? XD

also

The ONLY thing that is done is the layout. The stuff that isnt done is all both paths, weapons, pickups, spawnpoints & that kind of stuff. So that bug with the spawnpoints will be fixed anyways.

Also Ill add the weapons and health, then look into it ^^ Its my map, not urs :P
There's already wind at the flags if you didn't notice. Go to a flag, jump up and youll see you are moved by the wind. Projectiles affected by gravity will be taken by the wind aswell.

And I dont understand what you mean with the Minor Bug 2.B and Minor Bug 2.E^^

And I havent put any sounds in here -.- which I was planning to do.
Author:  Meatboy [ Tue May 08, 2007 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
Bulska wrote:

Also Ill add the weapons and health, then look into it ^^ Its my map, not urs :P
There's already wind at the flags if you didn't notice. Go to a flag, jump up and youll see you are moved by the wind. Projectiles affected by gravity will be taken by the wind aswell.

And I dont understand what you mean with the Minor Bug 2.B and Minor Bug 2.E^^




Heh, no doubt it is your map and not mine. I'll only offer advice on gameflow and mapflow take it or leave it.

I have been playing and reveiwing maps since Doom first came out. You can find my reveiws on LvL Big house, Map raider yada yada. I do know however what makes a great CTF map that remains on a server and maps that just fade away. That said I just play em not build them.

2B and 2E are not bug but suggestion for game flow ease. 2b Adding a way up from the lower Netural bridge, {The bridges that tie the opposing bases together} would give both attackers and defenders another action for get-away or ambush as needed.

2e An audible {A localized sound} at the point where the wind up wells will tell players "Hey Here is another way to move about notice me" Adding a sound at those ponts helps your player use the tool you have given them and adds detail and depth to the map.

On futher play of the map I noticed one major problem for game flow. The map has only two points to cross between the bases and that is the two bridges, So the map is choked. By Choked I mean that once you are free of the base with the flag, it is way to easy for an opposing team to set blockers on the entrances to each brigde.

Your bases have many ways to get to and escape with the flag and it is perfect for good gameplay. However once clear of the base you have a long run across two srtaight paths that are narrow and easy to defend. When playing with a team of humans your going to have folks lining up at either end of the bridges and stopping any invaders to there side of the map cold. Think a mini gunner on each level of the bridge and you having to run into with the flag. You might want to consider adding or paths or levels that folks can use to run the flag back and spread out the defenders.
Again it is your map and you do with it what you wish. For all the effort you have put into it I want to see this map be one that folks will keep on thier servers. This map is real nice and the concept is way cool. I look forward to seeing it in it's finial form.
Author:  Bulska [ Wed May 16, 2007 10:49 am ]
Post subject:  [MAP] CTF-B-HighUpDesert
If it is the middle part of the map you mean then I say this:

Use the two wind blows up in the middle to get more ways around.
Also, in the middle will be fighting alot, so your team should help you cross the bridge easily because the enemy is busy surving against the half of your team. Just have your team control the two towers and you win... unless someone snipes you off the towers and climbs in one himself.

There are multiple routes in the middle. Coming from top floor, you can run like mad right over the bridge or jump down at a mid-ground I've made at two points. You can also get down or up via the wind streams.

So... enough ways there, and the middle is the real challange.

Edit:

Im placing pickups now.
I replaced the usual staticmeshes of the pickup bases with others. Makes it more original.

Should I place health pickups at places where I suspect little combat takes place?
And should I place alot of healths?

Weapons and rest come later :P
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