Yep, i said it. I really think RS should not even bother with vehicle gameplay in its releases of BW on UT2k4.

#1: The vehicle combat in 2k4 is pathetic, insulting almost, even with RS's amazing skills, it wouldn't save the fact that UT2k4 wasn't truely made to have a amazing vehicle combat experience.
#2: As you've seen in Ut2k7 videos (however sparse they are), the vehicle combat is going to be way more involving, which i think is what RS would want.
#3: The AI isn't bright at all, in UT2k7, they'll be smart as hell
#4: Why the hell do you take personal damage when in a Goliath or HellBender? Thats not in UT2k7, at least it seems like it isn't.
#5: RS won't be able to fully do everything tehy want with the combat in 2k4, mostly cause 2k4 just wouldn't cope with it.

Well thats a short list why vehicles should be left out till the UT2k7 release. Bring on the flaming Bjossi.

6.UT2K7 won't have thouse karma issues with big vechiles (as they dropped karma) and personal weapons in vechiles will likely be doable better there aswell

interesting points there UP...id like to see more content for 2k4 before i make my 2k7 investment of $3000+ for a new rig and game but i agree mostly

agreed UP.. agreed

we at least want to get some practise in making vehicles though we probably be making some though.. might not release though

practice is always welcomed, but the overall enjoyment of the vehicles would be much better in UT2k7, where they feel like powerful ass machines of death and destruction.

UP has a good point, but people could be kept happy by releasing simple mutators for the vehicles that alter the weapons rather than the models, eg: change the hellbender weapons to a .50 cal and a minigun. if you know what I mean

or anything you make that will not make it to 2K7

I have some mut, that did that, to both the Hellbender and the scorp, i hated that bola gun crap.

You mean that "Plasma RIBBON"-crap.

Urgh... anyone who uses "Ribbon" as a part of a gun's name or features should be shot...

... in the groin...


... repeatedly...




... with a staple gun.

I'm looking at YOU, Microsoft Office 2007!!!

I thought that weapon was pretty interesting, although I found very little use for it outside of large mobs of slow moving zombies.

I think it could've made for a really cool weapon, but it didn't.

Yeah, I like Scorp's plasma bolo thingy. I would love to know how to just code a new vehicle since I had this real crazy idea involving vehicles for UT2004.

I'll make a topic for it in the vehicles section, even though it doesn't relate to Ballistics since General doesn't need another topic just yet. Plus, it's not so crowded and I'll know better when someone replies to that topic.

we'll see what happens

bad stuff about UT2k7 is gonna be normal maps really need to get into those

#1: The vehicle combat in 2k4 is pathetic

Apparently you have never seen Advanced Armor mod. Nor have you ventured out side of Lame Instant action AND Deathmatch. But then again I never got you confused you with someone that had grand vision...

Just my opinion. Leave the vehicles to the vehicle coders.

I have tried advanced armor mod, but still, it never feels, even in the bloody Leviathan that your commanding a powerful vehicle, thats just me.

if (when) we make vehicles.. then they will be decent

UT2004 and 2007 are different games. Godzillions of people still play CS 1.6, though CS:Source and UT04: Strike Force IV are around, the latter being probably ten times better then CS1.6.

In my country, Russian Federation, an average gaming machine is a 2.4 Ghz P4 with a gig of ram and a Ge-Force 6600. Yes, I meant 'gaming', common computers are even worse. My girlfriend is happy with her 300 Mhz piece of junk issued way back in 2000 if I'm not mistaken.

There are millions of people who will not bother about 2k7 until the year of 3k7. Moreover, I myself still enjoy playing Morrowind with good old mods as much as Oblivion, though the latter has outstanding graphics, physics and all. So I will play U2K4 mods along with U2K7. And so will do lots of people all around the world.

Making something like BW'2007 will take years, taking into consideration the fact that it took two years to develop BW and it's still in development!

So this means I should run around on foot in BW2k4 until someone makes vehicles for BW'2007 somewhere around 2009 ?

Also, I don't agree UT2k4 vehicles suck. They just don't feel like real battle vehicles. More like some oversized killer toys, but it quite fits the wacky UT2k4 atmosphere. If you want to drive real battle vehicles, go play BF2, BF2142 or Red Orchestra. Well not quite real maybe, but at least it feels you're a driving something very heavy and scary.

For UT2k4, advanced armor is the best option. And if the UT2k4 vehicles aren't the best stuff we can imagine, it's UT2k4's fault, not BW's.

So I'm looking forward to vehicles in BW'2004. An armored jeep, a hover tank, and a battle walker. I'd prefer a few really balanced vehicles which are fun to drive to a lot of mediocre ones, like in vanilla UT2k4.

They are planning on messing around with making vehicles in UT04, but they won't really start that until after 2.0 is out of the way and then some.

I know they are, but some folks are raising talks about dropping the idea 'cause 2k4 vehicles suck'

Yeah... I know... I certainly would love to see them in UT04 also. Especially the 'mechs and power armor!

Can't be power armour done via player model replacement?

Yeah, it probably could, I think that's how Systemic or something like that did it, worked pretty well, except the things' dual miniguns are nothing compared to the BW minigun.

Heh, it was just 2 UT2004 Miniguns... Not very effective. They were only good for high health.

What makes you think you need $3000? When UT3 will be on the shelves, you will hardly need more than $1000 to play at medium/high settings.


Now onto UP's points.

1) I agree there. The combat truly sucks, but it still does give a little new kind of combat experience. Which is better than nothing.

3) UT2004's AI is horrid, but what you say here is a theory, not the truth. Bots had potential to be smart as hell in 2004, so we don't know if Epic will learn from their mistakes until we start playing.

4) I hate that too. When inside a vehicle I want to feel totally protected from outside fire. But getting the player's HP attacked directly if the vehicle takes enough damage at once like explosions or railgun shot, would be ok.

I think RS could design the vehicles right now, but save the coding and implementation until DC gets his hands on the UE3 engine.

I agree UP, the vehicles can wait, and we can make do by turning the Vehicle Damage Scale to 0.75 which will still allow RPGs to nail Raptor's in one, but now the Goliath has a fighting chance against the Railgun.