They wouldn't be on the ground. I don't know where you got that from.

They'd be in a buying menu of sorts.

I dunno about that. The basic UT Deathmatch formula is what people are used to. Most of the servers I see don't run Loadout. Just basic Deathmatch with Ballistic Weapons instead of the regular guns. Complete with the default spawns for Ballistic Minigun and Lighthing guns.

Maybe 99% of people you know use Loadout. A survey of some of the servers suggests otherwise.

Also, to Senor Pantalones Feos, I'm saying that a buying menu of sorts won't alleviate the balance issues present in classic (weapon pickups on ground) Deathmatch. It won't matter how much a more powerful weapon costs when each one can be picked up from the ground for free.

To which Baklajan (you know until now I never bothered to actually read that name. I always read it as "Baklajaka" or whatever when I glance over it) replied "To hell with basic Deathmatch!"

UT is not BW, BW is not UT. As long as weapon buying does good to BW, it has a full right to replace the default UT way. I say, to hell with the old Deathmatch mode!

To which Baklajan (you know until now I never bothered to actually read that name. I always read it as "Baklajaka" or whatever when I glance over it) replied "To hell with basic Deathmatch!"[/quote]
ROTFL. Actually Baklajan, pronounced Bah-Klah-Jan, is the Russian for an... eggplant a.k.a. the aubergine.

Eggplants are delicious.

I know there won't be weapon pickups on the ground with a buying system. Unless of course you count weapons dropped by dead guys.

What I was referring to was games without the buying system. I know you don't care about it, but most people seem to do, as most of the servers I've seen don't use Loadout.

Oh, wow. I never would've guessed that.

Anyways, most servers don't use Loadout?

That really surprises me. That is one of the coolest things about BW, kinda surprises me that they don't utilize that awesome feature...

There might be a good reason for that.

2 Kaboodles: didn't you read my previous posts carefully enough? You can't take other guys' weapons. There's a certain money reward instead when you kill them depending on how many kills they had themselves.

So... My new job sometimes is very boring. Looks like I've got two hours of idle time ahead to survive through.

I had no time to judge on prices and weight yet, so I'm just putting crazy numbers; you are free to criticize them up to your heart's content.

SLOT I - Melee

I think everybody would agree that melee weapons would be the last thing that people would buy given a buying system. I also see no reason for giving out katanas for free, who would take a knife then? So my suggestion on this point might seem to radical... but... the knife, the katana and the wrist blades go straight to JW, or maybe better JW is incorporated into BW along with the buying system where katana takes the top place. All the melee weapons in BW are subsituted with the ultimate hand-to-hand arena weapon - Power Claws.

1. Power Claws
Weight: 4
Cost: N/A
Damage: High
Fire Rate: High/Medium (depending on the attack type)
Range: Hand-to-Hand


An upgraded version of Skrith Wrist Blades. Looks exactly the same but with sparks and arcs of blue energy jumping between the blades. Acts both as a powerful melee weapon and the shield gun. It keeps the two attacking moves of the default Skrith Blades, but also has an improved block feature bound to the Aim function. While blocking, the Power Claws generate a force field in front of the player capable of consuming up to 250 points of damage (with the same cool crosshands gesture).

The recharge period is 7 seconds, but the claws only begin to recharge after 7 seconds have passed since any damage was taken. In other words, you can't recharge while under fire until you escape it or kill your enemy. Any damage taken while recharging stops recharing for another 7 seconds, too. In most cases that means only one use per fight. When you're done and no damage is taken for 7 seconds, the claws recharge to the full over another 7 seconds. The same charge is spent upon impact when you hit the enemy with the claws in hand-to-hand combat, adding extra damage and armor penetration capabilities (but the claws are still fine to use even with zero charge)

The force field is designed to sustain one shotgun shot at point blank range or a couple of SMG bursts, nothing more. It gives the wielder a certain chance for killing an enemy wielding firearms, but you have to be an adept of dodging and acrobatics to be able to use the claws successfully enough. You can take a shotgun shot while blocking and feel fine, but another one will rip you into pieces (so the health of the force field should probably be adjusted to an appropriate value meeting the design requirements)

SLOT II - Sidearms

1. "M806" High Velocity Pistol

The basic handgun, given a somewhat low price not because of its weakness, but mostly for its wide usage, ease of production and lack of any special features save for the basic laser sights. A mass produced weapon good for close- and mid-range fights.

Weight: 4
Cost: $250
Damage: Medium
Fire Rate: Medium
Accuracy: Medium
Range: Close/Medium
Clip Weight: 1
Clip Cost: $10

2. RS8 Pistol

Weight: 4
Cost: $400
Damage: Low
Fire Rate: Medium
Accuracy: High
Range: Medium/High
Clip Weight: 1
Clip Cost: $15

A relatively new gadget meant to be an alternative to the M806. The most accurate weapon of the class, featuring close-range burst fire, silencer and laser sights. As the RS Wiki states, the low damage is compensated by bigger clip and better accuracy, but M806 and RS8 are roughly equal. Higher cost of the latter mainly stands for all the handy features and not the power of the gun itself - you CAN do just as well with a M806 if you know how to. M806 is a soldier's handgun, while RS8 is that of a hitman.

3. D49 Revolver

Weight: 6
Cost: $800
Damage: High
Fire Rate: Low
Accuracy: High
Range: High
Clip Weight: 1
Clip Cost: $25

A designer weapon produced in very limited amounts, unfamiliar to most soldiers and mercenaries. Only a few people know how handle it right, but in the right hands it can be devastating. The damage is very high due to the specific nature of the ammo used, and accuracy is nearly that of an RS8 save for a greater recoil.

4. AM67 Pistol
Weight: 8
Cost: $1200
Damage: High
Fire Rate: Medium/High
Accuracy: Low
Range: Close
Clip Weight: 2
Clip Cost: $30

A badass pistol meant to substitute an SMG yet remain extremely compact. Tremendous damage, extremely low accuracy, high cost, best choice for berserkers and close combat fighters but does no good at larger distances where RS8 would get 8 hits out of 10 shots.

5. "A42" Skrith Sidearm

Weight: 8
Cost: $1000
Damage: Medium/High
Fire Rate: Medium
Accuracy: Medium
Range: Medium

A fairly good sidearm handy almost in any combat situation and having unlimited ammo. It neither has any strong points nor weak points, being an absolute average among all pistols. It gives you neither advantages nor disadvantages. But if you are willing to hand out $2000 and take a couple of those in both hands, it can turn into a very devastating spitfire thingie.

6. "MRT6" Shotgun Sidearm

Weight: 6
Cost: $600
Damage: Extremely High
Fire Rate: High
Accuracy: Extremely Low
Range: Very Close
Clip Weight: 2
Clip Cost: $20

Almost useless in most combat situations, it smites enemies away better than anything else when it comes to hot close-combat action with no time to aim.

SLOT III - Light Tactical Weapons

A light tactical weapon may be kept along with a heavier weapon like a rifle, substitute it, or substitute the sidearm. If you've got a bag of money and can afford filling every weapon slot, this kind of weapon will still be useful along with the main rifle and the handgun.

1. XRS10 Machine Pistol

Weight: 10
Cost: $1500
Damage: High
Fire Rate: High
Accuracy: Low
Range: Close/Medium

Clip Weight: 3
Clip Cost: $30

That's exactly what the AM67 has always been dreaming to become. XRS10 has a lower damage though, but a considerably higher fire rate and a better accuracy.

2. Fifty-9 Machine Pistol

Weight: 12
Cost: $1800
Damage: Low/Medium
Fire Rate: Extremely High
Accuracy: Medium
Range: Medium
Clip Weight: $40

The Fifty-9 is arguably a considerable improvement over the XRS10. In practice, both prove to be roughly equal in combat, Fifty-9 having more range and being generally more versatile.

3. "XK2" Sub-Machinegun

Weight: 16
Cost: $2100
Damage: Medium
Fire Rate: Medium
Accuracy: High
Range: High
Clip Weight: 4
Clip Cost: $40

Having noticeably less raw firepower than the XRS10 and Fifty-9, the XK2 submachinegun clearly outreaches them both in range and effectiveness in prolonged combat situations. Actually the XK2 is close to being a light assault rifle, lower range and damage standing in its way.

4. MRS138 Shotgun

Weight: 15
Cost: $2300
Damage: High
Fire Rate: Low
Accuracy: Low
Range: Close
Clip Weight: 3
Clip Cost: $35 (5*7)
FIX: overall damage of a single shot is set to that of the M763.

You wanna have a shotgun along with the assault rifle but they take the same slot? Try picking an MRS138! It's basically a trade of range and fire rate for high damage and ease of use, being the ultimate light tactical weapon - it's wider spread as compared to that of M763 only helps it in this sense. Great for those who prefer assault rifles to SMGs and want to have a shotgun. Actually it's not much more powerful than an SMG, it's just easier to use, hence the high price (also explained by the fact the the gun has been issued just recently).

SLOT IV - Rifles


1. "M50" Standard Assault Rifle

Weight: 20
Cost: $2700
Damage: High
Accuracy: Medium
Fire Rate: Medium
Range: High
Clip Weight: 4
Clip Cost: $50

More accuracy to it...

2. SRS-900 Rifle

Weight: 22
Cost: $3500
Damage: Medium
Accuracy: High
Fire Rate: High
Range: High
Clip Weight: $70

Extra price because of the scope and the silencer and the overall better accuracy and damage. However it might be a bit trickier to use than the M50 and it actually isn't too much of an improvement over that, just an option with a bigger tactical potential.

3. "A73" Skrith Assault Weapon

Weight: 21
Cost: 3100
Damage: High
Accuracy: High
Fire Rate: Medium
Range: Medium
Clip Weight: 5
Clip Cost: $60

Self-explainable. Has no recoil (!!) and more stopping power than the M50, but slow projectiles make this gun not much better than the M50 at larger distances. Thus its gets a price between M50 and SRS900.

4. "M763" High Power 12 Gauge Shotgun

Weight: 19
Cost: 2900
Damage: High
Accuracy: Medium
Fire Rate: Low
Range: Medium
Clip Weight: 4
Clip Cost: $50 (5*10)

A counterpart to the M50 with quite a different functionality, yet easier and quicker to use on some occasions.

5. "M290" Double Barrelled Shotgun

Weight: 23
Cost: 3600
Damage: Extremely High
Accuracy: Medium
Fire Rate: Low
Range: Close/Medium
Clip Weight: 4
Clip Cost: $40 (5*8)

The price says for itself: no more M290 spammers. No, I'm not trying to say it's too powerful. It just needs a high price. People tend to stick to shotguns way too much, probably because they're very easy to use. Let's see if higher prices will convince guys to try the SRS900 and M50.

/NOTE/ More to come soon...

A bit of contradiction here... Shotguns are inherently cheaper than most rifles in real life...

Anyways, the 10-gauge should be more expensive than at least the Avenger. Its a tactical weapon, its a 10-gauge, and it looks a lot fancier. Those kinda seem to add it up to a much more expensive weapon in my eyes.

Also, the Fifty-9, based on its description, should be a really expensive gun. Its supposed to be a fancy, high-end SMG with lots of little doodads you can add and stuff, as well as probably a custom paint job if you really wanted to pay for it.

In real life, shotguns don't blast people away in million pieces like they do in BW

BTW, I forget what avenger is... seem not to find it in the Wiki

Oh, thats the M763.

Neither the 10 calibre nor MRS138's being tactical do not contribute to its price. It's a shortie with a more primitive design than the rest of the shotguns, save for the tazer and seemingly more advanced materials. Actually its smaller size and simplified mechanism makes it 'tactical', giving it a wider spread and quicker reload. It's definitely more expensive than any of the SMGs, but if we compare the amount of materials needed and production time required for making an M203, it appears to be more expensive. Maybe outdated, but still expensive. The classical revolver design of D49 is many millenia old by that time, but still it's quite expensive...BTW, the regular shotgun is only 25% more expensive than MRS138...

I dunno, still seems like it'd be more expensive.

But oh well. I'd think if a buying system was added the priced would configurable anyways.

Why wouldn't you be able to pick up your fallen enemy's weapons? You can do it in CS, and I think it works pretty well.

There's also a good number of problems with your pricing system. For one thing, the A42 being more expensive is silly, as the A42 is a peashooter at its current state.

There's also the XK2, which is by far the weakest of the submachine guns.

There's also the MRT6, which is very lightweight, making it quite easy to close distance with an enemy.

I hate do admit it, sir, that I do not agree with you on the A42 issue - it's a hell of a gun, let alone it being double-wielded (hides behind the desk)

XK2 is meant to be fixed - making it the strongest one, if not in firepower then in overall effectivness and versatility. I wrote all those little specs tabs below weapon names on purpose - as you might note, some of the info is different from what we have now. BTW, XK2 is not as weak as you say - probably you just don't know how to use it. Well, it still needs some improvement - such a long-barelled big gun in its class can't do worse than its smaller cousins...

To point out, why most servers dont use loadout, is simple. You can spawn with a G5 or rail gun and a lighting gun. Or even duel 59's. Hedsteem doesnt use loadout to control the amount of superweapons.

I'd much rather have an M806 than an A42, given the A42's severe lack of firepower. The alt-fire can does an average of 65 damage per second for torso hits, and 105 for headshots, far less than the M806 or RS8. The primary fire is even more useless. The Projectiles do very low damage, move slowly, and have a a low fire rate.

Its only advantage is in its long battery life, but the most important factor in a weapon is its ability to kill the enemy before he can kill you, and you really don't have that with the A42. Sure you can fire it continuously for about a minute, but the other pistols can take you from 100 health to dead in less than a second. A single A42 is simply not capable of that.

And you can't bring up dual-wielding, as all the pistols and submachine guns can be dual-wielded.



You can easily modify the Loadout settings to remove certain weapons from the Loadout selection. For example, on our old server, I removed the Minigun and Lighting gun (Superweapons, after all) completely from the Loadout menu, as well as the AM67 and M290 due to their overpoweredness. I removed the heavier weapons from the Primary Weapon slot, so that you can't hold both a G5 and a Rail Gun at the same time.

You can also remove the submachine guns and machine pistols from the Sidearm and moving them to Primary and Secondary, so that if you want to dual-wield Fifty-9s or XRS-10s, you won't be able to hold a heavier weapon like an Assault Rifle or Rail Gun.

Just edit your Ballistic settings on your client and copy the Loadout settings from your BallisticV2.ini to the server's BallisticV2.ini and you're done.