Oh quit yer constant whinin'.

Fer 1, your suggestions are not bein' ignored.
Second, ya' got someone workin' on a fix ter ya complaints right now.

Whining? I'd rather say buzzing around until someone notices.

Well, wutever ya call it, it's gittin on ma nerves.

*sits in a corner, eating some popcorn*

This is getting interesting...

Ah s'pose ya tink this is intertainin, do ya?

Well too bad, yer next.

[quote="Baklajan"]
Well I refuse to use either 'overpowered' or 'underpowered'.

Some of the guns are just unfair. That's all. After reading this whole thread once more I came to realize that we need to find means to balance the heavy weapons other than reducing their power or fire rate.

Dude Get a Life...Its a ♥♥♥♥♥ Game.

That was my thought exactly. One of my posts in this thread hints at that.

But BW is already very configurable. If you don't like unfair weapons you could simply leave the Mk9 out of the match by using the config menu.

I don't think we should alter weapons in any way when the ones who dislike them can easily avoid all trouble and just remove them from a match.

That's why some kind soul will just make an altered version of the Mk9.

Okay... the score so far...

... Ways to get weapons to balance themselves...

... X gets a southern accent when pissed...

... Baklajan still writes too long...

... BJ, Wup, and RedShift are agreeable...

Discuss.

if there were more people that had balance issues it would be considered. this mod has gone through many betas and as such i think the guys who participated know what they are talking about. no game is perfectly balanced nor will it ever be. point is the LG has limited range so you can plug the bastid before he zaps you if you have decent aim, the g5 has 2 shots before a reload and the rockets can be detonated by shooting at them, or easily dodged if they are dumbfired, i know i dont fear the g5, the RG has terrible refire rate and high damage, that is fair as it is....besides its got a frickin huge signature, a skilled fighter would be able to blast an RG sniper easy provided they survive the first shot. im not too sure about the minigun, i dont use it all that much, the assault pistol...sure its powerful but so are other guns, a shotgun blast to the head usually solves that problem

Do you play with bots or against skilled human players? Bots utterly suck at handling heavy weapons, I have no problems killing LG users, but when it comes to fighting against human players... the one who gets out their LG first usually wins. I'm forced to pick LG in loadout almost every time because it's a must if you want to win. If it weren't so, I won't complain about LG being imbalanced.

Without loadout, I don't see much trouble about LG - if you get it before someone else gets it, you're just the lucky one; in classic UT2004, the Flak Gun is much more power than the Link Gun, but nobody has ever complained about it. Who would deny that the classic Minigun is sort of tougher than a Shock Rifle?

But when you play Loadout, and that's my favourite, you choose what guns to get on every respawn. Everybody has to choose the same damned LG because it's the most powerful gun. That really spoils the fun.

MINDLESS SPAM!!!























Errr...
xD

Ok now no spam. I do agree that many weapons are overpowered. I always leave the stupid lighting gun out of Loadout, it looks awesome, but it KILLS ALL THE GAMEPLAY.
ALL weapons that blind someone are stupid if they blind too long. You make an enemy unable to do ANYTHING against you, making it target pratice running around! The flash on the pistol is great idea and other flashes too. But most of them are too strong. Like the Tactical Shotgun. You can't hit someone with that thing if you got a shock. It completely blinds you and then fades off. I think it should be better if it blinded you HALF, so NOT completely which makes you defenceless.

With overpowered flashing, a pro can be killed by a noob because the pro is blind. Try playing UT2004 with the screen OFF. Wow, thats gonna make you win!

Maybe make a paper bag to put on your head before someone uses a flash attack? Then quickly take the paper bag off and put it on your opponent's head, then shoot him while he can't see anything.

I like Baklajan's idea... hmm...

This is getting retarded, I mean come on...So what You hate the lighting gun, then take it out of the swap for the love of god, I mean..We use it at Hedsteem but VERY few and far between, It is over-powered ok..so what??...I have owned many people trying to shock me down...Its a matter of skill and knowing how and when to get the hell out of the way, If you know how to configure BW which most people don't then you can have a nice balance of weapons. Learn the way it works before you go turning this Great MOD into a god damn water pistol match.

Because all balance requires weakening the weapons to the point of uselessness...

Someone brought up CUT2? That is a very well-balanced mod, with a good number of, but not too many weapons. Every weapon owns in its own situation, but no one weapon dominates the entire game. Also, when put up against the UT2 weapons, they hold their own very well, meaning they are roughly equivalent in power and usefulness. WoE is similar, although considerably stronger than stock UT stuff.

BW, on the other hand, strives for quality AND quantity, but misses balance in the process. While a huge load of awesome weapons is in no way a bad thing, it quickly defeats its own purpose when a single weapon becomes the one that everyone NEEDS to have in order to win, and half the weapons are suddenly unused.

In this case, a single gun is good in nearly all situations, and offers little opportunity for defense. Now this may simply be the fact that these weapons really aren't made for UT gameplay, but whether they are or not, they are only in UT now, and people are asking that a problem be addressed. And I'll be brutally honest here, this group is one of the worst I've ever seen about accepting criticism. Denying the problem doesn't solve it, and can cause more trouble down the road as the mod or game grows.


The internet is no place to tell someone to get a life.

The internet is no place to tell someone to get a life.
[/quote]



Funny boy..Jackass

Alright, we are going to drop these derogatory remarks and other potentially hostile words right this minute.

Things are being looked into personally to see if some of you can be pleased.

Ill drop all my remarks, But If Runestorm Decides to Change the weapon physics then I'll need my own version of the mod for the servers you know the version that actually does damage.

Don't worry. AFAIK they are keeping it as is. In all its glory. All that good stuffs.

Take further complaints of the lightning gun here.

What?? Did I hear that some guns were unfair? Well darn we cant have anything be to powerful now could we, why that would be way to unfair. Wait I got it! Why not make none of the guns shoot but equip them are with long mean looking BBQ forks. That way every gun will be totally equal and we can all run around stabbing each other with forks on the ends of our guns. Whoops!!! will have to take out armor and health to, since somebody could use those to gain an unfair advantage. Can't have that either.

This thread is very close to being locked.

Its good to hear some action is being taken. We need solutions, not counter-arguments.

Thank you Captian Xavious (tips hat)

Wup dont panic mate, a small alteration in weapon behaviour wont mean that weapon is neccasarily gone. Nor does that mean the fun of it is gone too. The weapon physics shouldnt be changed anyway.

Take the Eightball for example, it fired 6 rockets at once. But they changed that to 3. Epic took away half its power but they didnt reduce its fun to a half. I still enjoy firing multiple rockets at peoples feet and sending their bodies to the roof all the same.

Alot of people think it was a good change.

It sounds like the backback theory is agreeable too. If that works then the lightning guns lovable power might just remain the same.

Wup doesn't have to worry about it. He can still use the original HVC.

Also, at risk of starting an argument... I thought the UT2004 Rocket Launcher sucked... I loved the Eightball much more.

But thats for a later time.

I still hope you realize that just because I nerfed the lightning gun (more like just made a weaker clone of it) doesn't mean I agree with you.

To clarify: I thank you for your attempt at making some form of action instead of continuing the chain of arguments. If you dont agree thats fine.

I wont argue your opinion on the RL either. Its not up to me to decide your taste in rocket launchers.

One other thing:
Im not one of those who dispise the lightning gun.

Oh, ok. No thanks is needed. I do it for the RS community as a whole.

Jesus. Can we keep it civil here guys? I almost wish I hadn't posted this thread.



I'm rather against the whole Rock-Paper-Scissors style of balance you're espousing. I don't want to have to carry around a specific weapon at all times to counter one specific weapon.

And about the flamethrower, are there really that many maps with a volume of water you can use? In fact, I'm willing to bet that a vast majority of maps are rather dry.

I'm curious. How many of you guys play online? Our experiences with the mod (and balance) seem to be drastically different. And what gametypes do you usually play? I more often play deathmatch or Arena Master style games on pretty much the entire range of map sizes. Usually about 4-8 players (human)

I'm sad to see this thread went this way. Lock it if necessary. I'll post another one, hopefully with a little more tact

There are many more things to discuss here I believe.

Ok, now before anything else is said by you, download that tweaked version of the lightning gun and tell me what needs work.

Second, I'm still not seeing balance issues with the flamer. I find it tough to go against in my Pit level, due to lack of space, but not a particularly spammy weapon, even when the arena is quite literally covered in flames. Please PM me some suggestions on how some of the settings can be tweaked and I'll see if I can alter that to your liking also. But not till Sunday, gotta go away for a few days.

[Quote] Jesus. Can we keep it civil here guys? I almost wish I hadn't posted this thread.

(Me too)

Never doubt the talents incorporated in Runestorm.

Lock it..Yawn

It will be locked eventually... I just want to see what else has peoples' underwear in a bunch, maybe I can please them a bit, though I am not altering every single weapon, just whatever ones they feel need it most.

Note: Don't even think about asking me to fix any weapons you think are "underpowered".